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The boys are back in studio (Thursday Show Thread)

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Matt Jones and Ryan Lemond are back in studio today to discuss Rick Pitino’s “Cash Me Outside How Bow Dah” moment after last night’s game, Kentucky’s NCAA tournament hopes, good news for UK football, and much more.

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Article written by Drew Franklin

I can recite every line from Forrest Gump, blindfolded. Follow me on Twitter: @DrewFranklinKSR

77 Comments for The boys are back in studio (Thursday Show Thread)



  1. runtsfan
    9:58 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

    I want no part of Carolina in the postseason. They were really good last night.



    • RealCatsFan
      10:56 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      Yes, I agree and it makes me very sour. They should be serving the death penalty right now for the academic scandal, but the emperor (NCAA) has no balls.



  2. Laker Cat 18
    10:10 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

    North Carolina, Kansas, and UCLA are the 3 best teams right now. Hard to go with anyone outside those three as a favorite.



    • Realme
      10:14 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      But Vegas prefers Ky and Duke. It’s interesting.



    • Sentient Third Eye
      10:31 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      I still don’t think the NCAA has a team that would be even a “2” seed most years. This is a majorly down year for elite teams, but there are a lot of “pretty good” teams.



    • ukjaybrat
      10:40 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      i’d say anyone in the top 20 can win it this year. this will be a banner year for true “upsets”. and i’m not talking about 8/9 or 7/10. there will be a lot of teams go down a lot earlier than predicted because the middle of the pack is just as dangerous as the top this year.



    • Mc12
      10:46 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      Oregon



  3. runningunnin.454
    10:12 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

    Haven’t you all heard…Gonzaga is the best team in the country.
    Heh, Heh, Ha Ha.



  4. Realme
    10:13 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

    Well, y’all. I looked up some numbers last night to beef up my defense of Briscoe, and it didn’t go as well as I’d hoped. Checked everyone’s plus/minus for the season, and he was the only one below 7 that plays, except for Hawkins and Humphries. Everyone else was in the 8-9 range. Doesn’t mean he’s bad, but the others are objectively having a better impact on the games than he is overall. He is better than last year, however.



    • WatchutalkinboutWillis
      10:16 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      How do those +/- work?



    • Realme
      10:19 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      I don’t know how they calculate it, but it’s supposed to be a measure of how well the team does when you’re in the game vs. when you’re out, based on the other stats. 0 would be an average player, 9 is Malik Monk.



    • Realme
      10:21 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      It’s in the last column under advanced stats.
      http://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/malik-monk-1.html



    • J-Dub421
      10:22 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      What are Willis’ and Mulder’s +/- since everyone thinks they should be getting Briscoe’s minutes?



    • ukjaybrat
      10:23 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      +/- is a measure of how much of a factor you are to your team.

      “An example of Plus/minus is as follows: let’s say a player’s team was 7.5 points better than their opponents when he was in the game (+7.5). When our player was not in the game, however, the team was 3.3 points worse than their opponents (-3.3). To find this player’s +/- rating, you simply take the difference of the two numbers, which yields a rating of +10.8.”
      https://www.sportingcharts.com/dictionary/nba/basketball-plus-minus.aspx

      on the other hand if while you’re in the game your team scores 10 points more than the other and when you are out, your team still scores 8 points more than the other (you being out wasn’t that much different), you subtract the numbers and your +/- is only 2.0



    • Realme
      10:25 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      The number I was looking at was “box plus minus”. Is that the best one to use, or should I be looking at something else Jay?
      Jdub, they were better than Briscoe, to my surprise.



    • ukbradstith
      10:26 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      at Missouri Briscoe had the highest +/- on the team, + 13, I believe.



    • CATandMONKEY
      10:28 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      Of course that doesn’t necessarily mean that one individual player is the reason for good or bad play during that time…you have to remove other confounding variables in order to make a reasonable cause/effect analysis. I suspect that over time you can suggest a trend though.

      “The Strengths and Weaknesses of Plus-Minus

      Given small sample sizes (one game being the smallest), plus/minus is an interesting, yet seriously flawed statistic, in that it is exaggerated by the ebbs and flows of the game. One team goes on a 12-0 run over two minutes of game action, and suddenly the five guys on the floor at that time are statistically punished. It’s impossible to determine how much blame each of the five guys deserve in that two-minute span. One can argue that the weakest defender on the court is usually a part of the opposing team’s biggest run, but what about the other four guys? Plus/Minus does a better job of evaluating performance over an entire season, as the ebbs and flows will tend to balance out. ”
      Darko index



    • J-Dub421
      10:32 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      I don’t know how good a measure +/- really is though. Do you ever look at the stats in the BBNBA articles? I’ve seen Boogie and KAT have like 30 points and 15 rebounds with 5 assists and have a negative +/-. I have no idea how and suspect it’s because their teams are terrible.



    • ukjaybrat
      10:33 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      Th Box plus minus (BPM) is a rate based metric. that is more useful in the nba where all players are on a somewhat level playing field. i didn’t even know they calculate that for college. i usually look at +/- which is more stats based and a more tangible measurement. But it still has it’s flaws described by what C&M just pointed out. all players on the court get punished if there’s one flaw in the defense that keeps getting exploited. You could have 4 all-star guards on the court but if your center is getting abused 1-on-1 in the paint, there’s nothing those guards can do about it.



    • ukjaybrat
      10:36 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      The +/- is also a bad indicator of individual performance also because of what jdub just reminded me of. it is very rare that a player on a winning team will have a negative value and it is very rare that a player on a losing team will have a positive value. it’s just how the numbers work out.

      However if you do have one of those scenarios, a player with a negative value on a winning team means he shouldn’t be playing as much and a player with a positive value on a losing team means they should have been playing much more.



    • CATandMONKEY
      10:39 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      You could have a 3 min period where the opposing team shoots lights out and perhaps your player is only in for those 3 min but the guy he is guarding didn’t score at all. Your guy who was only in for those 3 minutes would have a terrible +/- for that game. Again that is a VERY small sample size. This would, as the quote noted be lessened over the course of a season.



    • Realme
      10:42 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      Okay, so now I want to know what IS the best way to use stats to compare individuals on a team to each other? My own eye test still says Briscoe is one of our most important players. But where to look for evidence?



    • Realme
      10:45 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      *over the course of the season



    • CATandMONKEY
      10:46 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      Well there was a poster last night ( whom i have never seen before) who evidently knew all the answers 😵



    • J-Dub421
      10:49 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      Yeah, that dude was an irrational idiot who just hates Briscoe.



    • UK Big Board Update
      10:55 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      “Irrational idiot” is a severe understatement.



    • Realme
      10:56 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      Gotta go to a meeting, but have enjoyed our discussions as usual.



    • ukjaybrat
      10:56 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      any stat in a vacuum can tell a lie. the best metric for anything is time. because even an amazing stat or an awful stat for a single game can’t tell a picture. season stats are where it’s at. gives a better scope for the bigger picture.



    • CATandMONKEY
      11:01 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      Peace, Real.
      Meetings will eventually be the end of all civilization and administration will still tout their importance.



    • J-Dub421
      11:05 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      Hope your meeting isn’t too boring Realme.



  5. spaghetti
    10:20 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

    Been under a rock last couple weeks. What happened to the 4-6 PM re-air on 1580 AM in Lexington?



  6. runningunnin.454
    10:27 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

    Petino has over achieved with this year’s team…but, he is cracking under the pressure over the off-court incidents.



    • J-Dub421
      10:33 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      Pitino is also an extremely sore loser.



  7. rick64
    10:32 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

    If student sections are chanting or yelling racially sensitive material, stuff like that. First the home team coach goes to the PA system warns them, if it persists, then you call a technical foul on the home teams bench and it’s two shots and the ball for the visiting team.



    • ukjaybrat
      10:38 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      if you can get a tech for throing things on the court, you can get a tech for going WAY over board with what you say. otherwise we aren’t far off from players jumping into the stands. was it marcus smart that almost punched a fan for calling him the n-word (allegedly)? personally i think fans have no business being close enough to the players to make that even a possible outcome, but some arenas are built to have the fans right on top of you and that’s the kind of stuff you are inviting in.



    • runningunnin.454
      10:47 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      You’re right, Jay; this year Malik Dime of Washington was suspended after slapping a Colorado fan that was heckling him.



    • J-Dub421
      10:58 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      Smart did hit a dude and got suspended for a few games (4 I think, but I won’t swear to that). I think the guy who used the racial slur also got banned from games, but I could be wrong.



  8. J-Dub421
    10:37 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

    I’ll ask again for all the Coach Cal haters, who do you think we’re going to legitimately get that’s a better coach?



    • ukjaybrat
      10:38 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      phil jackson doesn’t seem to be doing too well in new york. maybe he will come to lexington /s



    • CATandMONKEY
      10:41 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      I am waiting for someone to bring up Rex Ryan. Ha.



    • rick64
      10:48 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      The haters never seem to have a logical answer. You’ll hear names like Tom Izzo or Brad Stevens. Those guys ain’t going anywhere.



    • CATandMONKEY
      10:50 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      …and neither of those guys are a better coach; though if Cal were to leave we could do worse.



    • CATandMONKEY
      10:53 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      Jdub, where is your Avatar?



    • J-Dub421
      10:55 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      I always hear Coach K, who is never leaving Duke.



    • Realme
      10:55 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      C&M I see Jdub’s but not yours.



    • J-Dub421
      10:55 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      I can see my avatar, you can’t?



    • CATandMONKEY
      10:57 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      I don’t have one…that I know of. Not seeing Jdub’s on my end.



    • CATandMONKEY
      10:59 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      All I see is the “G” turned 90 degrees counterclockwise. Just like mine. 😛



    • J-Dub421
      10:59 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      Ha, weird.



    • CATandMONKEY
      11:03 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      Maybe my KSR bandwidth is being throttled due to my 2 or 3 comments to that dude that are “awaiting moderation.”



  9. runningunnin.454
    11:03 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

    I still think I have the answer for the Mulder, Willis, and Hawkins minutes dilemma. We should play a trapping 1-2-2 zone press the entire game. Have any of you pressed an entire game…exhausting.
    We have the depth, and all the players have the experience to be on the court; and everybody would be playing until their tongues were hanging out.
    Or is that too simplistic?



    • CATandMONKEY
      11:05 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      I have not played it but am tired simply considering it. Simplistic does not always mean bad or ineffective. I will defer to your bball experience and say “Why not?”



    • J-Dub421
      11:10 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      I just want Monk, Mulder, and Willis to hit shots. I have no advice on how to make that happen.



    • runningunnin.454
      11:15 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      I like the balance on the team, and think it should be utilized more. One thing for sure; Mulder, Willis, and Hawkins do not hurt us when they’re on the floor…if anything, I think sometimes they suffer from a lack of confidence. And sometimes, Briscoe and Bam are exhausted at the end of the game, and their FT’s and overall game suffers.



    • J-Dub421
      11:40 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      We usually hit free throws at the end of games when we need them, even when we’ve missed earlier in games.



  10. Not Dan Issel
    11:07 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

    Not a “better” coach necessarily, but if Cal were to leave for any reason soon, Greg Marshall (53) and Archie Miller (38) are excellent potential replacements. My preference is that Cal stay until he is 70.



    • J-Dub421
      11:09 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      I wouldn’t mind either of those guys if Cal retired, but I sure as heck wouldn’t fire Cal for either of them.



    • ukjaybrat
      11:24 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      one of them will end up at IU after this season. so that pool will shrink immediately



    • J-Dub421
      11:38 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      I totally think we cool steal whoever we want from IU.



    • Sentient Third Eye
      4:27 pm February 23, 2017 Permalink

      When Cal eventually goes, it will be a TOUGH transition for us back to mortal standards. The next coach will suffer because of it.



  11. J-Dub421
    11:08 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

    Duke lost and U of L lost. All in all a good night.



    • CATandMONKEY
      11:12 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      “The schadenfreude is strong in this one.” …and I totally agree.



    • J-Dub421
      11:38 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      If laughing when Duke and U of L lose is wrong, I don’t want to be right.



    • runningunnin.454
      11:39 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      Don’t speak German; now I’m thinking streusel and schnitzel and I’m hungry.



    • CATandMONKEY
      11:44 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      With the exception of that word and a few others from psych and philosophy classes ( and food!) my very limited German language vocabulary is totally based on Hogans Heroes.



  12. CATandMONKEY
    11:32 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

    Writing in cursive in medical charts has been the source of countless errors. I switched to printing on charts 15 years ago. I still use my ” baseball card” cursive signature though. Printing is far less ambiguous due to numerous styles of cursive taught regionally and in different eras. Cursive is a great style to learn as an elective but in the computerized world of today it is not necessary. I would much prefer more emphasis be placed on grammar and critical analysis. Oh one can dream …



    • runningunnin.454
      11:41 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      No cursive writing? Just think, if Jethro had calculators, he wouldn’t need cipherin’.



  13. secrick
    11:39 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

    Pitino should be suspended for one game for his actions last night . The guy looks like he might go out like Woody Hayes did at Ohio State. Sorry been on the job this morning but have read all your post.



  14. CATandMONKEY
    11:40 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

    Is Ryan reading contracts written on a bar room napkin? All my contracts in the past 30+ years have been typed.



    • J-Dub421
      11:41 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      I have never seen a handwritten contact ever. I have worked in the legal profession for over a decade.



    • CATandMONKEY
      11:49 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      I still have a handwritten contract on a 3×5 index card; for a Savage .22 rifle and one box of ammo, for which I paid my uncle $10 in 1977. I was nine. Still have the rifle…but not the ammo.



    • CATandMONKEY
      11:50 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      Guess it is more a ” bill of sale.”



  15. rockman
    11:51 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

    Cursive writing throwback…remember that just 2 years ago, Karl Towns wrote his goodbye love letter to BBN in cursive and he did it over 40 times in painstaking effort in order to make it look good and be easily readable. If KAT understands the importance of cursive as far as it conveying deep emotion(as Oscar points out too), then maybe we should reconsider the importance of cursive as well? Respectfully, Jack Lewis(Frankfort)



    • CATandMONKEY
      11:58 am February 23, 2017 Permalink

      Letter writing in itself is unfortunately a lost art. I DO believe a cursive correspondence seems more personal. My penmanship though always gives me pause.



    • Sentient Third Eye
      4:28 pm February 23, 2017 Permalink

      A person who cannot read and write in cursive is not educated.



    • CATandMONKEY
      8:03 pm February 23, 2017 Permalink

      Third Eye, if one grew up in what I would assume was “our time” I would certainly agree that having no cursive skills shows an extreme deficit in education.
      Of course one could argue that if one is unable to at least perform basic integral calculations and have a fundamental knowledge of two non-native languages ; that person is also uneducated.
      It is a matter of degree I suppose.