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Closing the book on the worst loss of the Mark Stoops Era

I’ve seen a lot of bad Kentucky/Tennessee football games in my life, but this one may take the cake. I don’t think many fans expected the Cats to beat the Volunteers tonight, but I don’t think anyone expected a 52-21 annihilation.

Believe it or not, it was even worse than the score indicated. I wasn’t sure it was possible, but last week’s disappointing performance in Starkville looked decent in comparison to what happened in Commonwealth Stadium tonight. Considering all the progress the program has made off-the-field in terms of recruiting, facilities, etc., what happened on the field tonight makes this the worst loss of the Mark Stoops era. By far.

In that spirit, let’s keep banging our heads against the wall and break it down.

First, an unfortunate injury update

Boom Williams went down with an elbow injury in the second quarter and did not return. Judging by the replay — which I never hope to see again in my life — it’s pretty bad. Joey Herrick also went down with a right knee injury. Garrett Johnson went down hard, but should be okay. Wondering why we never saw Drew Barker? His shoulder was too banged up from last week for him to play.

It started off on a good note

Things didn’t look great when the Cats went three and out to start the game; however, CJ Johnson made everything better when he scooped up a fumble and returned it 77 yards for a touchdown. I wish I had bottled the energy in the stadium up in that moment, because it was pretty much downhill from there.

What the hell is going on with the offense?

Eight games into the season, I still have no idea what’s going on with Kentucky’s offense. At times (fewer and fewer as of late), the offense looks great and other times, it looks like something my five-year-old nephew drew up (actually, that may be giving them too much credit). Remember in the preseason when we said Patrick Towles was one of the best quarterbacks in the SEC? In the past two games, he’s looked like one of the worst. Tonight, Towles was 16-33 for 184 yards, 1 touchdown and 1 interception. He also had one touchdown rushing, a 1-yard scramble in the second quarter, although that didn’t even inspire a lot of confidence. Patrick stutter-stepped across the goal line, hesitating to turn north and just get the ball in. I thought Jared Lorenzen was going to puke.

How bad was UK’s offense early on? At the end of the first quarter, Tennessee had 144 yards to Kentucky’s 2. TWO. After briefly getting their act together in the second quarter, the offense sputtered again, not scoring again until Garrett Johnson pulled in a 39-yard touchdown pass in the third quarter. That was the last gasp before the Cats collapsed on the mat.

The defense wasn’t any better

If the final score wasn’t indication enough, Tennessee had their way with Kentucky tonight, putting up 482 yards of offense. Joshua Dobbs had four touchdowns, two passing and two rushing. Kentucky’s run defense actually held their own against Jalen Hurd for a while, but he, Alvin Kamara, and John Kelly were just too much in the end, combining for almost 200 yards. To add insult to injury, Tennessee had touchdowns off kickoff and punt returns, the first time they’d had both in one game since the 1950’s. Ah, Kentucky football: helping other schools break records since forever.

In the past three games, Kentucky has gotten really, really good at falling to pieces right before halftime. Tonight, Tennessee scored two touchdowns in the final five and a half minutes of the first half, and it just got worse to start the second, the Vols scoring two more touchdowns in 42 seconds. DJ Eliot tried calling the game from the booth for the first time tonight, but if anything, I think it made things worse.

Ready for more bad things? Kentucky had 9 penalties for 93 yards. Hey, Tennessee, enjoying that game on a silver platter? Let’s cut up your meat for you too.

Stoops was just as angry as you’d expect

I didn’t think it was possible for a human being to be angrier than Butch Jones, but Mark Stoops gave it his best shot in the postgame presser. Stoops was practically purple when he came into the postgame press conference, keeping his answers curt and clipped.

“It’s not acceptable,” Stoops said. “It’s not okay. Not very pleased. …Give them credit, they beat our butts in all phases. They were much more physical than us. And we’ve got to play with a lot stronger attitude and mentality than that.”

Yes, they do. Now 4-4, Kentucky’s entering a very dangerous stretch. Yes, two winnable games in Charlotte and Vandy remain, but tonight’s performance doesn’t inspire much confidence, especially for the latter. Last season’s collapse looms large, and the most troubling aspect of tonight for me was how the team gave up. Three years in, that should not happen, no matter what team you’re playing. Stoops noticed. 

“We have got to face adversity better,” Stoops said. “We have got to be able to handle it and manage the game and not let it get out of hand.”

How do you even move forward from this mess?

“I don’t want to see one person dropping their head or moping around,” Stoops said of his message to the team. “That’s not going to be the way it is. It’s clearly not acceptable, and we’re not okay with it.”

“You can’t hide. You go to work, you man up, and you go get better. You go coach better, and that’s the way we’re going to do it.”

Most of you will spend the night pointing fingers and debating which quarterback should start going forward, but for me, the problem runs much, much deeper. Kentucky football is quickly becoming defined by errors and missed opportunities. That “explosive offense” we once had confidence in is now a ghost of its former self. For all the buzz around the program, the recruits, the upgrades, etc., it’s clear that the program has momentarily stalled, stuck in first gear at a crossroads. Losses to Florida, Auburn, Mississippi State, and Tennessee are far from the end in the world, but the manner in which the last two happened reflect some serious growing pains.

But for now, as Patrick Towles told reporters after the game, “getting your ass kicked sucks.”

Article written by Mrs. Tyler Thompson

No, I will not make you a sandwich, but you can follow me on Twitter @MrsTylerKSR or email me.

205 Comments for Closing the book on the worst loss of the Mark Stoops Era

  1. DavidAxel
    12:27 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Matt just cut off and insulted a Tennessee fan for making a very good point about Stoops and his record. Coaching a historically good Florida State defense to wins isn’t that impressive. Look at his record elsewhere as a DC.

    • UKFootball4Real
      12:53 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Agree with you DavidAxel…

      Don’t BLAME OUR COACH… blame the A.D. for bringing him in to UK.

      a). Last night you saw a coach (Jones), that Mitch (UK A.D.) did not offer, beat the pants off of a coach (Stoops) that Mitch (UK A.D.) did hire.

      b). Don’t forget: Mitch (UK A.D.) hired a head coach… which did NOT HAVE HEAD COACHING EXPERIENCE (Stoops).

      c). This is the SAME UK A.D. that let Tubby Smith stay too long (Tubby himself got out of Lexington before he was forced out),

      d). This is the SAME UK A.D. that went to the state of Texas to hire a Basketball Coach (Gillespie) and ignored coach Calipari.

      e). This is the SAME UK A.D. who took a football program on the “upswing” (Coach Brooks) and placed “a friend” (Joker) in to the head coaching position and SUNK THE UK FOOTBALL PROGRAM in to depths that we still can’t get out of.

      Sure: Stoops is a better recruiter than Joker. But Stoops is NOT the coach to coach / inspire / motivate this UK Football Program to the level of SEC Competition. If you can’t see that in three years… your blind.

      BUT: that’s not Mark Stoops fault. It’s the UK A. D., Mitch Barnhart, who continues to make BLUNDER after BLUNDER and gets praise for it???

      We need change…but not just in the Football Program.

      GO BIG BLUE.

    • krautdog
      1:38 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      This is THE SAME AD that let our winningest coach(Hal Morris) walk away because he wanted to make room for his “buddy”(Brooks) to take the job!

    • Dylan
      12:42 am November 2, 2015 Permalink

      I like stoops, but man you might be right. After last night’s game I am starting to question this program.

  2. wildcat502
    12:37 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Stoops reminds me of Aunt Bee to Otis Campbell, “Get back to work.” I really wouldn`t mind loosing to great teams, just give me a good product on the field. Give me something that doesnt embarass me. We cant point fingers here, no one player stood out as being bad, about 20 of them did. There wasn`t any sign of heart nor concentration in this game. Most of the holding penalties were due to protecting Towles from being killed, after the linemen were beaten badly. Tennessee`s defensive ends were going around our tackles before they even got into some sort of position to block.
    Dropped passes are killing us as well and thats concentration. Are they afraid of being hit?? Drop football then and find another sport. Football is a contact sport.
    Can we win out?? Sure. Can we lose out??? Oh yea

    • Kevin
      12:38 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Spot on Totally agree!!!!

  3. Cletus69
    12:39 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Cause Matt is a classless douche! UK football…perennial doormats of the SEC!

  4. ArnoldthePig
    12:40 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Even Bear Bryant could not beat Tennessee… That’s why he left…

  5. KSR Spy
    1:00 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Hey good news…basketball Monday.

    Other good news, we won’t lose to Georgia this badly.

    • Heywood Jablomie
      10:50 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Congrats!!!! Only five posts in before it’s the same story as every year – Jus wait’ll baiskeetbawl season by gawd! Hahaha.

  6. Nuclearcontamination
    1:20 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    We won’t face a more athletic team than Tennessee. Those hillbillies are flat loaded. They are recruiting at a higher level than UK. This team will get much better under Stoops, but not this year .Sucks that Boom got hurt. It’s that time of year, the return of the same ole Kentucky and Basketball starting… GO CATS’

    • Tommycatsfan
      10:34 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      It beat us by 34 last year. Only beat us by 31 last night. Yep. We are much better.

  7. Not acceptable
    1:46 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    I have been for Stoops and kind of still am. But if people are not doing their job send a message and get them out. Pat needs to sit, if Barker is hurt play the next guy. I am sick of seeing the same players screw up. Same goes for the Oline, someone else needs to be given a chance. They can’t miss any more blocks or have more penalties than what he leaves out there. Same with defense-how many tackles we going to watch be missed, get them out and give the next guy a try. As for effort, if a player stops showing effort I don’t ever want them on the field for my team again. I guess we should not be surprised by getting blown out…look at reality. We beat terrible teams in ULL and EKU barely at home. We beat a bad Mizzou and USC team in not very impressive fashion. Now we are playing much better teams and it shows how far away we are. I do believe we have some better players than ever before, obviously not nearly enough of them. Still it is not too much to ask to see effort and since we no longer get that I will not be at the last 2 games, tix have been listed for sale, I will not give the team my effort without getting it in return. Really debating if I will renew next year, these type of games will kill our recruiting, guarantee we see several players back out.

    • Cats paw
      7:04 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      With all due respect….your support is the very reason that this program has remained the doormat of college football. If you continue to support and follow mediocracy what incentive do they have for improvement?

    • Watch The Game
      8:56 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      And play who on the offensive line??? The kickers and punters??? We already go 9 deep on the offensive line because we mass sub every 3rd or 4th series to help keep everyone fresh. There’s no sub to make on the offensive line because everyone already plays and honestly I can’t tell much of a difference between the first 5 and the 4 reserves. Our offensive line play is terrible and unless we do a better job of recruiting that position we’re screwed even with all the playmakers we have for the future.

    • FernCreekCat
      9:08 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      In response to comments about the OL, why does John Schlarman still have a job? He’s held the OL coaches job at UK twice and has failed miserably both times. Name one player who has improved since he’s coached them? Where has he ever been that was successful? Maybe an FBS school but never at the major college level.

      Stoops needs to take a hard look at his asisstants and weed out those that are not producing quality players. Most of these guys are coaching at the highest level they have ever been at. Of course so is Stoops. Look at the asisstants resumes, these are not sucessful coaches at the Div. 1 level. Some heads should roll at the end of the season.

    • Watch The Game
      9:20 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      I think you meant FCS not FBS but I hear you.

    • cats paw
      9:45 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      fern creek– what i dont understand is why you put the blame on everyone and everything except the very person (stoops) responsible for hiring these people. according to everyone, he takes no control over the offense, defense, recruiting or special teams. just what does he do to deserve 3.5 million/yr?
      its about like God creating a flood to kill every human on earth to rid the earth of evil… but leaving the very one responsible for all the evil (devil) alive to continue the cycle. makes perfect sense

    • Not acceptable
      12:36 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      We have 17 OL on the roster so if we rotate 9 we have 8 not playing. Imagine they are trying to redshirt some of them but need to put them out there and see if they have any heart, guys we play now sure don’t. And agree with other comments-Stoops needs to get rid of the OL and D coach friends or not, it will cost him his job. Neither is getting better, actually getting worse. I am just so mad I am going to say no more and care no more. Tix are listed for sale, knowing I will not get what I paid for them and not caring. Show me a reason to renew or like many others I will show no effort, like the team, when it comes time to renew my season tix.

  8. BluKudzu
    1:51 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Anyone remember the last UK win? The come from behind overtime win at home to EKU?
    The only team (5-3) UK has beat with a winning record, which competes in the lower level FCS Division. Yeah, THAT EKU.
    My comments on a prediction I had made following that game were moderated off all discussions because I predicted exactly what we are seeing now.
    I had even mentioned that Charlotte was not a certain win for us. I still do not think so.
    This is coaching. This is about not understanding your players, their strengths and weaknesses, and not adapting schemes that give them the best chance to win.
    Don’t even get me started on special teams. Coach by committee, for gosh sakes, relieve that committee of their responsibilities today. Find the backwards hat dude, he wS better than this.
    We may have honestly seen our last victory this year. I said it last week, and was highly criticized; the toughest part of our schedule is in front of us (at the time I was including UT) not behind us.
    It is going to get worse.

    • Veritas
      8:35 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Nailed it. Agree 100%. Time to think about replacements.

    • BluKudzu
      11:06 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      TT, when you say winnable against Vandy and Charlotte, you mean there is a chance? There is also the chance that they beat us. If so, they finish ahead of us, again…that is what we need to look at as far as gauging the improvement for this team.
      We don’t beat Vandy, we got zero chance at Louisville.

  9. D
    1:17 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Have you seen a lot of bad losses in your day, Tyler? Save the drama for your mama. You live in another state while covering the cats and you are a relative child. You don’t know what to compare bad loses to–believe me, there have been worse ones than this. Do you remeber the Arkansas beat down where they called the game- thank god- because of the weather? There are many like that my non sandwich making friend.

    • chilldude
      1:25 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      she says in the Stoops era not all of history, I am sure she, a relative child, has been around that long.

    • Chubbs
      6:04 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      She is so full of herself, she has to put “mrs” in her name. Yeah, um, it’s fine. Congrats. You are married. No one is after you, Tyler. Oh, she also won’t make you a sandwich. Who would say that? Strong, married, independent woman she is. God help the dude who married her.

    • TPACAT
      7:22 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Uh, I think she started doing that since the name Tyler can be male or female…

    • Sheeeeiiit
      12:18 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Yeah you guys are being jerks. She used to go by just Tyler but little [email protected] in the comments referred to her as a dude so she added the Ms. to clarify. I have been reading the site for a while. I really liked Matt and Beisner’s writing and the site misses it. But I’ve really grown to enjoy Tylers writing as a replacement on this site. I live in Nashville and being in another city doesn’t make me any less of a fan. Yeah you guys are just being jerks.

    • Leuther
      7:04 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      You guys lay off Mrs TT. She’s a class act. If you think you can do better, send Matt Jones a resume. He’s always looking for new talent…

    • sdcro
      8:46 am November 2, 2015 Permalink

      learn to gentleman, bros

  10. f you all
    1:20 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    There are 3 if not 4 winnable games left. Vandy and Charlotte are wins, and uga and ul arent that good.

    • Not acceptable
      1:26 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Neither are we. Had to have an amazing comeback to beat EKU so no games are considered wins at this point.

    • f you all
      1:40 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      We will beat vandy and Charlotte. Probably lose to uga. And eek out a win against ul

    • j4
      6:19 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      let’s see f you, how many people said that florida wasn’t that good? how many said that auburn wasn’t that good? there are not two wins left on the schedule. there may be one. as long as this team relies on patrick towles, they will fail. as long as this team continues to give up big 3rd and 4th down plays, they will fail. There is no chance that UK beats Georgia next week. That game will be as bad as this one. Vandy will see this game as one of the biggest of the year because they view it as extremely winnable, so UK will see their best effort. UK has not shown that they can beat hooker U. I’m not convinced Charlotte is a win either. this is a poor football team with poor coaching. I wonder why Dawson wasn’t allowed to call plays at WVU. What’s the over under on the attendance for the last two home games?

    • Cats paw
      6:58 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      I personally think UK may win two more games and that will be the very worse thing that could happen to this program! It will have the homers thinking we have reached that turn around point and their dreams of relevancy will be fulfilled. Then we will be stuck with another 10 yrs of hoping we can beat an OVC team in order to qualify for some cereal bowl game.

    • Ha!
      7:42 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      I have to agree with Cats paw on this one. UK fans will believe that just qualifying for a bowl game will justify this season and this coach. I would rather stay home than be involved in some ‘participation bowl’. Kind of like the trophies they give out to young kids so they don’t have to feel like losers. Your aspirations as a fan base and a team are sad. You keep going back to beating UL and how your record might be better than theirs when the season is over. Not very lofty goals. Set your goals higher and become a real UK fan and STOP with this troll crap I see here all the time.

    • barney howard
      8:41 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Only a true idiot Kentucky fan would believe you can win 3 more games.U of L is a far better team and Vandy is too.Stoops should have played Louisville first game this year.5-7 easy this year.

  11. Pharmboy
    1:35 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Yes he had a rushing td, but that one touchdown you reference was a 39 yard pass to Garrett Johnson.

  12. bluetwo2
    2:03 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Shout out to Cody Quinn who continues to the those things he is really good at!

  13. First Down Kentucky
    2:37 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    As soon as you stop celebrating first downs, you might be a decent program. What program announces over the PA, ‘FIRST DOWN KENTUCKY”. Really??? But you will always run to horses and basketball. I don’t think anyone can save your fan base, you’re idiots.

    • BtownUKFan
      8:32 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Uh….like every announcer does that at every game. At UL games the home crowds chimes in so you can hear it on TV. The idiots are the loser fans from other schools that feel the need to come on to Kentucky fan site to insult the fans at 2:30 in the morning.geeez. Get a life dude !

    • CATandMONKEY
      9:21 am November 1, 2015 Permalink


    • Tommycatsfan
      10:42 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Probably only Kentucky announces “first down Kentucky” over the PA system but I may be incorrect? That UT edumacation is really paying off for you.

    • Chad McAlpin
      10:20 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Florida State does

    • Stickman
      11:34 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Why would another school announce “FIRST DOWN, KENTUCKY” if they are not Kentucky? You are a retard, and should most likely go drink some antifreeze.

  14. Abdul Aziz Ramadan
    4:01 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    I bring you greetings from Dr. Mustafa bin Fakir, the president of the UK Pakistani Alumni Association. He is very disappointed in the performance of Coach Stoops, his staff, and the team

  15. Hakanes
    5:11 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    I have been watching UK football for over 50 years. We the fans that have supported this football program deserve better. I’m a UK grad and so is one of my children., I will always be a fan. However I’m old and tired. Therefore I am going to have to think long and hard about renewing my season tickets next year. Tailgating and attending the games have been a huge part of my life , I will miss it. I am a bigger football fan than basketball fan. I do not know where to go from here to fix our football program. That’s Mitch’s problem!

    • Coach Jamin
      9:20 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      It’s funny you say that. I remember a lot of us were saying the same thing midway through Rich Brooks 3rd season at UK. If I remember correctly, things started turning around pretty drastically the following season. Keep the faith. If after year 5 we are not an 8 or 9 game winner, then we can start to question the coaching methods.

    • Edward
      10:43 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      This post from Hakanes is exactly what I was planning to say. At 69 years, I no longer believe that I will live long enough to see my school, UK Class of 1969, become relevant on the gridiron. There are just too many other options for things to do on beautiful Saturdays in the Autumn. Emotionally UK is simply not worth it.

    • Tommycatsfan
      10:46 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Yeah, I too long for those jaw dropping 5-7 and 6-6 seasons under Brooks. Sigh……

    • Heywood Jablomie
      10:55 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Hakanes and Edward…What took you so long to finally figure it out? LOL!!

    • krautdog
      1:57 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      I fail to understand why some UK fans worship Brooks! I must have missed how many winning SEC seasons he had.

  16. Echo1
    5:13 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Losing is one thing. I expected it. But, getting humiliated two weeks in a row? This team is regressing this season, not progressing. And that is just bad coaching. I’m certainly not calling for Stoops job, but he really needs to up his game. He gave us the hype. It’s time he delivers some.

  17. Belbivdivoe
    5:23 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Can we please stop with Stooos going anywhere else?
    After yet another lackluster perfermormance in a big spot for team Hype, let’s get Stoops focused on winning a big game here before we give him another pay raise out of fear he will go somewhere else. And fear is all it is in good measure based on the nearly 3 years we have to go by. I know, it’s Joker’s fault right? At least he beat the Vols in one of his three seasons. Recruiting headlines are great, but if you can’t coach you are eventually exposed. Could that be what is happening here? At least in the meantime can we please not buy in to the fear Stoops will leave us with all this stellarness he has built and give him yet another raise?

  18. markp
    6:19 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    That was horrible. In the words of Jack Lambert, ” they ought to make them wear skirts.”

  19. Hang on Stoopy
    6:26 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    That performance was scarier than Margaret’s phone call a couple week’s ago.

  20. Cats paw
    6:50 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Looking to place blame? Look no farther than the fan base that supported the hiring of Stoops by Barnfart and the outrageous salary paid. Blame KSR for the propaganda used to inflame homers of all the great turn around and improvement we were seeing with this team. The sad part is that this fan base is so use to losing that they consider a 6 win season as an amazing accomplishment and will support a 5 yr contract extension if we were to reach it. That will ensure another long run of total irrelevantcy for kentucky football. Hate all you want….If UK would have hired Petrino when they had the chance this program would be a true SEC contender at this point.

    • Tony
      8:50 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Amen, to bad we are not classless , win at at cost thugs!

    • Acc
      9:09 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Petrino can’t get lolville to be a contender in the Acc…. What makes you think he’d get uk near the top in the sec

    • CATandMONKEY
      9:24 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      I would take Cats Paw as coach before Petrino. Would rather disband the team than hire Petrino. Would rather go 2-10 every season than hire Petrino.

    • Jeff
      9:57 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Can’t get them to be a contender in the ACC? In only his first season as head coach they finished 3rd in the Atlantic division behind only Florida state and Clemson. This season, in only his second year… Once again they sit at 3rd in the divison behind Clemson and Florida state. I’m sorry, but that is a pretty good start with a brand new coaching staff. I’d surely take it. Count me in the group that believes we definitely should have hired petrino. He would have had us winning by year 3 at least.. Maybe sooner.

    • cats paw
      10:02 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      although zero of you would admit to…. you said the very same things about Calipari b4 he became UK’s coach (ask Matt Jones). now he’s suddenly a great guy. no, its not win at all cost but its better than paying a coach 3.5 million to make you feel embarrassed for your school every week. i think petrino is like 57 and 14 at Louisville.

    • CATandMONKEY
      10:54 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Nope. Cal is a decent human. Petrino is a piece of excrement.

    • Cats paw
      1:27 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Catand Monkey— Google “who is considered the cheatingest coach in America” and tell me what you come up with. I think you’ll also find a couple quotes from Matt Jones (pre Cal days) stating he could never support Cal because of his poor character!

  21. Kurofmi
    7:05 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Since the coronation of Mr Stoops all that I have heard how he will succeed. I have been watching uk football since childhood. Blanton Collier, Charlir Bradshaw, John Ray (he was the ND coordinator bound for glory lol. I recall him as mr. 2-9.), Fran Curci my favorite, MD was so glad to get rid of Claiborne that they had a parade when he went to uk, Bill Curry the s.h. Philosopher, no D Mumme, old coach Brooks…no one else would take it, I’ll skip the next loser, then our current coach whose claim to fame is his surname. I have seen Nothing that would suggest that he is genius, gifted or even competent to Head Coach in the sec. In the closing moments last evening he looked lost. It was the first time that I have felt pity for a uk coach. Or perhaps it was self pity for wanting to believe the hype set forth by children who write about subjects for which they hold no Life experience.

    • markp
      7:21 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      I am not making final decisions on Stoops yet. However, let’s not stoop, no pun intended, to U of L’s level where we hire very good coaches who win but have no ethics. There are plenty of winners out there who are not scumbags like Pitino, Petrino and Jurich. This is not the Oakland Raiders, ” just win baby”, it is a university where people are being molded to be the adults that lead the world later. So let U of L have their attitude about win at any cost. We should strive for better and I think Mitch tries for the higher ground.

    • markp
      7:46 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Curci was the most successful coach we’ve had in my lifetime. The team that finished sixth in the nation under him only lost to Baylor, at Texas on artificial turf and over 90 degree heat, early in the year. They could not play in a bowl due to NCAA infractions but probably would have beaten anyone at year’s end. That being said, and I liked Curci a lot due to the winning, that era of Cats were in a lot of trouble to include a campus murder. We should strive for better.

    • Kurofmi
      8:06 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Curci was under tremendous pressure to win. He was the pioneer of recruiting FL due to its tremendous talent base. He used Fanizi on option plays and my former teammate Ernie Lewis as drop back passer early on. He could recruit and played to each players it Sonny Collins at tailback or Jim Kovach at lb. Sadly Venus Meux and some others drove around with a murdered body in their car trunk. That was illegal and against team rules. The momentum turned and he became yet another rung on the ladder that under the cover of fog appears to ascend heavenward. Sadly when scrutinized in sunlight it is revealed to be only a step ladder.

    • yodelaheyoo
      12:28 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      What’s the story with the murdered body? I was aware that there was trouble on campus in the Curci era, but never to that extent…

    • Cats paw
      1:22 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Markp— your comment is proof of your hatred for UL overriding common sense. You and every fan thought of Pitino as a God when he was at UK. He was the EXACT same douchebag when he was here as he is now and you supported him! Of all the crazy incidents that have ever happened to college coaches…the only one’s that are ever mentioned or are unforgivable are those belonging to a Louisville coach? Bruce Pearl has the lowest character in sports but UK fans just think that’s cute…..because he isn’t associated with Louisville. Calipari is regarded as the cheatingest coach in sports (Google it) but he never coached at Louisville so it’s all good. Save your moral argument…you just hate louisville

    • Danny Mac Boy
      3:42 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Give me John Ray any day over most of the coaches you mentioned. Hell he’d easily go 6-6 against the wussy weak schedule UK plays nowadays. Charlotte, Eastern, Lafayette – hell just add 3 wins for john ray against the schedule he had to play. And besides he got Commonwealth Stadium built and left one hell of a crop of players for Fran Curci.

      I agree with you that we need Fran Curci!!! Give me probation any day if we can go 10-1 and give Georgia worst defeat in Sanford Stadium history and have Tennessee fire their coach after loosing to UK

  22. fatbrat
    7:14 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    The one bright spot on offense was Mikel Horton. Mikel ran like a man on a mission.

  23. UK Fan From Florida
    7:30 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    All I will say for the next 14 month is I told you so… because I think it will be the end of next year before they pull the plug on Stoops. I am a former graduate of UK, a proud fan…. I’ve seen plenty of bad coaches … this guy is bad….really really bad. I think our Homer fans have a hard time accepting the truth and will only attack the messenger. Do you wanna know how much of a difference a good coach makes… look no further than Harbaugh… same Michigan players and totally different results. Hey guys wake up this is YEAR 3

    • Tony
      8:51 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      He is beyond BAD, look at the half time adjustments…what a great staff in general.

    • "former graduate"?
      9:19 am November 1, 2015 Permalink


      Yeah…sure you are. LOL

    • OldTimer
      9:23 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Great point about Harbaugh. Great coaches inspire players no matter the talent level

  24. Can't get the job done
    7:43 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Well, at least we look good with our fancy black uniforms and chrome helmets. Too bad, they do absolutely nothing to help us play better. But hey, we at least good while getting beat in all aspects of the game, so there’s that.

  25. Steve
    7:53 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Hey Tyler….we did not “say that Towles was one of the best QB’s in the SEC,” KSR did. I never drank the kool aid that Matt the Democrat was brewing. I have said time and time again that this team will not go to bowl game with him as our QB. The coaching staff is terrible. Tom Leach said that TN was getting pressure with just rushing 3 or 4 and KY had to rush 6. The O-line and D-line coaches should be fired immediately, these players are not learning any technique at all. Special teams suck because we do not have an official coach at all. We will never be more than a doormat in the SEC, Louisville was smart, they went to the ACC. We will never get beyond the cellar door recruiting nothing but Ohio, talk to Bill Curry. The recruiting will start to suffer now, there is absolutely no improvement and I will say that we probably had a better team last year. Every win this year has been a struggle. If Stoops is not fired this year, he will definitely be gone after next year. His handling of this team is pathetic. Remember Bill Curry always saying we need to get bigger, stronger and faster at the end of every season: then every recruiting class was our biggest and fastest, but then at the end of the season we need to get…..A 4 or 5 star recruit at 24/7 sports (the KSR recruiting site of choice) is more like 2 or 3 star.

    • Sec
      9:13 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Why are you here? You dislike the site and the writers. Are you stupid or something?

    • OldTimer
      9:25 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Imagine what the fan base would be saying about now if we had lost to EKU which by all rights we should have

    • CATandMONKEY
      9:28 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Lost any possibility when you stated : ” Matt the Democrat” who cares if he is a liberal or conservative? Irrelevant to this conversation and shows your agenda up front.
      Signed, NOT a Democrat.

    • CATandMONKEY
      9:31 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      ….lost any possibility of credibility…which is unfortunate because I agree with many of your points. OL sucks, D sucks most of the time, special teams; basically non-existent. We have some great skill players but minimal bread and butter players that would allow our skilled to actually show said skills.

  26. timer
    7:54 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    I feel bad for the players.

    Zero game plan by the coaches with no in game adjustments. I still believe we have enough good players to be competitive in all SEC games. UT and MSU are second tier SEC teams….Think of how bad it would have been if we had been playing LSU or Bama last night.

  27. The Bell Witch
    7:56 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Crooked “K”, Halloween Night… what did you expect?

    Did you see Iowa’s beautiful matte black helmets they rolled out?
    Noice, right? UK had the chance to roll out a gorgeous matte black
    for the blackout, but instead they go with… chrome.

    Stop the gimmicks. Give us our damned UK logo back that doesn’t
    look like a joke. Focus on basic football. It’s not that frickin’ hard
    to figure out. But instead, UK football is so busy being new and cute,
    there’s no actual football being played.

  28. Ha!
    7:57 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Stoops Troops deserve all they get for believing in this clown and now they are spreading some fictitious story about Miami wanting this disaster as their coach. This is an attempt to offer relevance to this non coach by his supporters (Barnhart and the others). I would be calling up Miami and telling them we will pay the fare to get this guy there and can you take him before the end of the season.

    • OldTimer
      9:28 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Stoops was angry last night?? Stoops was angry?? Let me guess he said coaching needed to be better.

    • Heywood Jablomie
      10:58 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Miami?? Why not USC? Haden likes hiring idiots. Or South Carolina? Pffft. Not even Maryland wants this guy.

  29. The Rest of the story
    8:00 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Lots of disdain for the coaching now. I thought the Stoops hire was a good one too. Lots of hype and Yhatzees over recruits. Cats look soft, weak, no fundamentals in tackling, out of shape and poorly conditioned. These things are not the fault of one single player. I truly cannot see one coach on this team that has a clue in how an SEC team should play in any phase of the game. Dawson is just a terrible hire as this offense remains offensive. DJ Eliot has now coached the worst defense in the SEC for 3 years with no improvement at all. The lines on both sides of the ball look like they are playing for the first time. Finally Stoops has failed to impress the fans and has failed to make good decisions for this team and its players. This is nothing but a coaching failure across the board. I feel sorry for the players as they try so hard but are not prepared to play in the SEC by the very coaches they put their futures in the hands of. Six wins is not an improvement for this team it would only be mediocre. No one wants mediocre and the loyal fanbase that has put up with it for so long deserves better than that. I am disgusted as so many others are and Stoops owes all of BBN an apology.

  30. SinceStollField
    8:03 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    We get dominated, yet somehow we lead 14-10 in the second quarter. Then what do we do? We have Quinn, our worst defensive back, matched up one on one deep with no safety help and give up a 75 yard TD. Sorry, but that’s just bad coaching. Really, really bad coaching.

  31. Johnny Cutz
    8:08 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Well, hey, our QB has the best hair in the SEC, right KSR? Don’t worry, Patty Ice has got you. Wink wink.

    • leon singleton
      8:55 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      I Think our team is gay.

    • Tony
      8:58 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      That’s the one that makes me I’ll, his little pretty boy shake of his golden locks… Looks like a kid that can’t afford a haircut to me… Pretty boy wannabe PUNK for my money.

  32. Mr Blue
    8:09 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Oscar Combs was talking to Dick Gabriel I believe , before the start of the football season. He was saying how difficult this years schedule was. It wasn’t necessarily about the win/loss record as far as showing improvement. There just better not be any blowouts.I think the last two games qualify as blowouts. It’s an embarrassment to see the fans filing out of Commonwealth Stadium early in the third quarter like the place is on fire. You football junkies better just accept the fact that football will never be anything better than mediocre at UK. No matter who the coach is. What Rich Brooks had going back in the mid to late 2000’s is as good as it will get.
    Basketball starts soon.What we don’t need is the idiots calling the pre-game shows before basketball wanting to ask football questions.What questions can be asked? I know the answer to pretty much all of them. The football team SUCKS!

    • OldTimer
      9:31 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      The fans collective walkout of Commonwealth in the third quarter after a day of joyous celebration over American Pharoah’s win should be the lasting image for this coaching staff.

  33. Ghost Town
    8:09 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    When do those 2016 season tix go on sale?

    • Joe Ticker
      10:08 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Hey, Ghost Town! The 2016 tickets will be available at Good Will in December.

  34. Marine 1
    8:16 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    You have got to use your TE to be effective these days. We have such a predictable offence that everyone watching knows what they are going to do. From the top down it’s on the coaches!!! Who would want Mark Stoops. Stupid talk!

  35. True UK Football Fan
    8:32 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    I’m tired of this and I’m not talking about Kentucky football. What I’m tired of is all of the negative fans out there. This is not basketball and you can’t rebuild a team in 1 year with a single recruiting class. Seeing the difference in the talent level of the players that UK puts on the field now compared to 2 and a half years(+ 1 game) ago is very promising. Not many first time head coaches have to deal with the poor talent level that Stoops inherited when he first got here. Even D. Mason had better talent at Vandy when he got there. That should tell you how Joker left the program in shambles. Nobody has ever recruited on the level that Stoops and his crew has at UK. For those of you who blame Towles for everything, STOP. You obviously don’t know anything about football. Yes he has made some mistakes, but nobody is perfect. He can’t catch the pass for receivers when it hits them either in the hands or chest(which it should never get that close to their body). He can’t block the pass rushers and then throw a pass. He can’t move the receivers when he’s scrambling for his life and they just stand there watching instead of trying to get to an open spot on the field. On another issue, I’ve had season tickets since Couch was a freshman and I have never even thought about not renewing them. If you have to think about it, then you’re not as big of a UK football fan as you think. It seems that some of you out there have forgotten something. So here is a reminder, Stoops is a first time head coach, Elliot is a first time DC and it’s the first time Dawson is actually calling plays. There have been and will be growing pains. We as fans has to push through them just like the players and coaches do. We need to support this team even in the hard times. If you’re a bandwagon fan then jump off the wagon we don’t need you. If you’re a true fan, keep your negative comments to yourself and look to the future not the past. It is much brighter than I have ever seen. We have to remember these are kids playing a game not a life or death situation. I think we have a legitimate shot to win every game we have left. I know it’s not probable but it is possible. GO CATS!!

    • The Rest of the story
      8:49 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      LOL OMG you are totally addicted to the Blue Kool-aid my friend. True you cannot build a football program like UK had before Stoops in 3 yrs, but you should see some improvement. There is none my friend. This team has struggled in every single game they have played and look worse this year than last. By all rights this team should have only one win and you and everyone else knows it. This is not about “bandwagons” this is about incompetent coaching from the top down and if there are a lot of fans like you who want to wait this out then UK football is done, finished, and gone for a real long time. This team has gotten a lot more support than it deserves because of the players but the coaching staff of kindergarten coaches is killing us, Wake up and look at the real world dude.

    • Kurofmi
      9:05 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Another UK apologist. WHY are we an OTJ learning center for FB coaches??? I cannot fault an individual for being incompetent. Most incompetents don’t realize or believe that they are. The AD vets and researches hires. The fact that Stoops approached Barnhart speaks volumes. I will say this in all seriousness. He is Lost. I can see it in his eyes. He is terrified of replacing Towles…for some internal reason. His play calling is suspect. And frankly I don’t blame the defense for laying down. Two yards in the first qtr at home with a supposed huge rival? Besides flicking his mane, Throwing behind receivers and running for his life after the first read (and keeping his perfect interception streak going) what is Towles doing than any other cannot do?

    • True UK Football Fan
      9:18 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Yeah, I guess I missed that play where Stoops missed that tackle or where Mainord dropped that pass or where Schlarman had that holding call or where Ansley got burnt on that deep pass or well you get the idea. Coaches do not play the game. Have you been at every practice? You must have to know how they are coaching their players. I’m sure they’re not coaching them to miss an assignment or to hold or to drop passes. The coaches always say it’s their fault, it’s part of the job. You never want to throw a player under the bus(even though there have been times I have literally wanted to). I’ve played football from the 2nd grade until I was a senior in high school, so I have a pretty good idea of what happens during a game and during practice. Also, there has been improvement. You’re just too blind from all the hater-aid you must have drank. Of course I’m upset about the losses, but I know you can’t win them all and sometimes you get blown out in those losses. You also win games you probably shouldn’t. And by all rights this team could very well be 6-2 if a couple of plays go a different way. 1 of those games being a FL team that has only lost 1 game to a very good LSU team. I personally think Stoops was the right hire, but if I’m wrong I’ll admit it. For instance, I didn’t like the Coach Cal hire at first because I bought into the hype of him being a scumbag and a cheater and I was completely wrong on that. From the beginning I thought it would take at least 5 years to get the football team turned around. Also, at the start of the season I was predicting 6 to 8 wins. Seems like we are on course for that.

    • Kurofmi
      5:40 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Do you realize that UT could easily have scored 3 if not 4 more TDs? Thank god they called off the dogs and gave the scout team some much deserved reps. Yes we dropped passes. But I resent being called a hater. Just another liberal who cannot accept harsh and sad reality. When someone states that the King has no clothes…since stats cannot refute you resort to juvenile name calling. Rest assured I know more about the Heartbreak this program brings than all the articles that you (might have) read. I have been listening (yes listening) to the Cats since the fifties. There was no tv to speak of (nd and usc perhaps). In college we would drive to the top of Red Mtn in Birmingham where I attended graduate school. Clear channel whas came in with intermittent static and echo. We never missed either a bb or FB evening game. That’s fandom. If you wish to live in a deluded state then feel free. Time is the ultimate test. We’ll know if the wheels are off the wagon soon enough. Be well and grow up strong young man.

    • True UK Football Fan
      8:35 pm November 3, 2015 Permalink

      Kurofmi, the hater remark was for Rest of the story not you. I didn’t even have time to read your comment when I posted mine. Also, I was born in ’77 so I’m not so young anymore and have seen and heard my share of heart breakers. Don’t jump to conclusions just because my post was right after yours.

  36. Mr. Mojo
    8:35 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    I’m disgusted along with the rest of you, but I’d like to ask a serious question. What alternative do you propose? On the assumption that we can’t hire Nick Saban or some other really proven coach (a pretty solid assumption, I think), who do you hire? Don’t say “anybody”, because that’s cheating. Who, specifically, do you want? Anybody you can name who might actually come here will look an awful lot like Stoops, Joker, or Curry before they got hired here. In other words, there is no perfect hire. I’d like to hear what you think, but if you throw out a name, make sure it’s somebody who you think would come, and who somehow doesn’t fit the profile of past unsuccessful hires.

    The point I’m trying to make is that hiring somebody new just because he’s new is really stupid. In three years, whoever he is, we’ll be saying the same thing about him that a lot of you are saying about Stoops right now. If you expect a complete turnaround in three years, you’ll never get there. He may or may not prove to be the right guy, but you can’t make that determination yet.

    • The Rest of the story
      8:57 am November 1, 2015 Permalink


    • Appalachianassassin
      9:51 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Mack Brown. Mike Leach.

    • UKWB
      10:27 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Agreed – look at TN and their coaching turnover – the revolving coaching door does no good. We don’t need to keep bad coaches around forever, but dismissing coaches because we’re not immediately winning doesn’t do us any good either.

    • Heywood Jablomie
      11:03 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      The alternative is already in play. The women’s basketball and softball teams and the baseball team have improved dramatically over the past few years. UK football = same as it ever was or will be. You guys should be thankful Vandy is in your division. At least you’re not the laughing stock of the SEC every year.

    • Mr. Mojo
      11:52 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Mike Leach is 17-28 at Washington St in year 4. Is that really significantly more success than Stoops? He’s only appealing right now because he’s not named Stoops. Mack Brown looks a lot like Bill Curry to me. Any others?

  37. Lola
    8:36 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Are you guys kidding me? Do you remember the last few Joker seasons? We are absolutely on the right track. Pat sucks because he has no protection. This is the problem right now: we have no depth. When our starters get banged up, he’s still playing people because he has to and not because he wants to. Our recruits are young and we will slowly build depth but it doesn’t come in three seasons. And anyone who even thinks about looking at Florida or Michigan’s first year coach is an idiot. They inherited substantially better talent than we did. And we have a first time head coach. He’s learning as he goes. There is a steep learning curve in the SEC. Look, If we go to a bowl this year, the season is certainly a success because that is all that should have expected this year. Anyone who thought we’d waltz in and win our way through the SEC should stick to basketball. Yea, we got crushed and we looked terrible. But we have 2-3 winnable games left and this season should be judged at the end. If we don’t make a bowl at the end, we will certainly be having a different conversation.

    • CATandMONKEY
      9:40 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Agree Pat has no protection. Until we go three deep on OL and DL we can’t try to play textbook SEC style ball. As has been mentioned previously: imagination, creativity and shaking things up once in a while (punt from the 50, really?) would go a long way towards allowing us to be competitive against classic SEC squads. It might not be pretty but Jesus, what we have been given this season sure as heck isn’t pretty and we aren’t usually competitive.

  38. DesignatedDrinker
    8:37 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Excellent post. Right or Wrrong, fire Shannon Dawson groans are gaining traction in the stands. Heard it in Commonwealth and on the early walk to the truck afterwards. People are all over the defense but the defense gave them the lead and was on the field FOREVER in the first half. 3 and outs are getting old. And Special Teams is a joke after UK was the place to go for Punters and kickers with a solid return game for most of our history, 6-6 is a solid year, but this is a 5 year process and hopefully the last 2 weeks will kill the Stoops to a traditional power talk for another year anyways.

    • PatbeingPat
      1:05 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      The 3 and outs don’t help but the defense is on the field alot because they can’t stop anyone. The fact they are on the field so much is just as much their fault as the offense. Remember the Auburn game, first drive Auburn was like 5 of 5 on 3rd down {guessing as I don’t remember the exact numbers since we have given up 1000 1st downs this year on third down plays}. The D is horrible and could not even stop ULL and EKU which some High School teams could stop.

  39. Big Worm
    8:40 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Looks like Boom is out for the rest of the season. We will have nothing left when the dirty birds come rolling in.

  40. Piedma Schwartz
    8:41 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    All you crybabies need to change your diapers and grow up. We still win the last 3 games handily, finish 7-5 and win a easy bowl game. 8-5.

    • Jim
      8:43 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      You’re an idiot if you think we beat vandy and looserville handily.

    • Piedma Schwartz
      8:47 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      And you’re just a pathetic human being, Jim. Quit being a cats fan, real fans don’t need you bringing down the fanbase.

    • jim
      9:28 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      This coaching staff is bringing down the fanbase. Tell us wise one, what has Stoops and company shown us that we should be supporting? Vandy defense is now improved due to the head coach taking it over, unlike Stoops he made a decision and it is working. Keep being a Homer and enjoying being at the bottom, it’s fans like you that encourage games like last night.

    • Stickman
      11:49 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      You are an idiot “Piedma.” Go jump off the Clays Ferry bridge and do us all a favor. You’re about as much a real fan as you are a real smart person.

  41. Jim
    8:41 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    If i was a recruit and i seen this disaster there is no way i would come here. Heck, if i was on this team and could i would transfer after this season. This isn’t the players fault, this is all on the coaches. Any coach that can’t make decisions during a game or be prepared for a game needs to go. He is going to ride that Towles train right to the unemployment line, i would run the wildcat all night before i would leave hair boy in there for one more play. Just as bad as the Joker days, maybe worse.

    • Piedma Schwartz
      8:45 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Why don’t you just go cheer for Louisville? Better yet, go cheer for the Patriots, Yankees, and Lakers, too.

    • jim
      9:25 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Boy, you Homer fans just can’t handle the truth can you? I’m glad you are for being at the bottom of the SEC year after year.

    • True UK Football Fan
      9:31 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      It’s not a matter of being glad for being at the bottom. I didn’t know it was considered to be a homer if you support your team no matter what. I just thought that was being a true fan.

    • Heywood Jablomie
      11:05 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Well I peed my shorts reading this. My keyboard is getting soaked from the tears of laughter.

    • Stickman
      11:50 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Hey “true UK football fan” you obviously don’t know what a true fan is. A true fan cares enough for the program to not ignore the truth. A true fan can read the writing on the wall and hope for a change. You are not a true fan, you are a true moron.

  42. True UK Football Fan
    8:45 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Amen Mr. Mojo and Lola.

  43. uk78
    8:46 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    I aree but as uk football fan i would like to see a little improvement from week to week and it is not happening

  44. Wald
    8:55 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    People!!!!! It’s Kentucky football we r talking about. We have always been horrible and we always will. It’s funny to me that there are ppl out there who actually believe that we will turn it around and become a sec contender 😂😂. Will never happen! Idc if we somehow were to hire an elite coach,, we still wouldnt win. This is a basketball school and town. Football is just an excuse for all of us to go get drunk for a few Saturday’s every fall. It’s basketball time so for me personally i prolly will just catch bits n pieces of the remaining games n catch the final either here or sportscenter. Quit getting high expectations ppl. Enjoy the bourbon, tequila, wine, rum, beer, your plate of chicken fingers from chick fil a, corn hole, and getting dressed up n showing your ass to everyone at commonwealth.

    • True UK Football Fan
      9:27 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Can you give me a legitimate reason why we will never be good in football?

    • CATandMONKEY
      9:42 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      We have almost 70 years of history to back up his contention.

    • #[email protected]
      9:47 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      I can, you’re uk.


    • Reasons
      9:58 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Here are a few:

      1. UK does not have a built in recruiting base to sustain a top-notch team. The best UK can do is get 2nd tier players from Ohio that Ohio State has passed on. Now that Michigan is relevant again, UK will have a harder time with those.
      2. UK itself isn’t large enough to sustain both an elite basketball team and an elite football team. Basketball will always be the dominant sport here. No elite football coach will want to take a back seat to the basketball program.
      3. UK is a basketball first program in a football first conference.

    • True UK Football Fan
      10:06 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Sorry, but if you think the past is a legitimate reason you’re dead wrong. Look at Puke for example, basketball school and pretty much in the same state as UK in football. Cutcliffe has been there since 2008 and has a record of 46-50. So they have given their coach that long to build that program and this year they are 6-2. Should be 7-1 if not for that crazy play. So, apparently the past doesn’t matter when it comes to winning football games. Who knew?

    • cats paw
      10:14 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      reasons— would you care to explain how Louisville managed to be a top 10 team a couple times in recent history being from the same state? or how Eastern and Western have just as good of programs as UK? a great coach can win with the current talent UK has! we put amazing athletes in the pro’s every year

    • Kool aid sucks
      10:33 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Geez Mr. True UK FB fan, are you 12 years old? Because then I could excuse your complete failure to grasp the reality of UK football. Reason why we will never be good? I give you history. Except for a couple criminal years under Curci, a couple of lightning in a bottle years under Claiborne, a good Tim Couch that could not overcome corrupt coaches that could not define the word defense, and a good man Rich Brooks that knew that he would never do better than the Woodson, Burton, Tamme years, then what do you have in the last 65 years of UK football? Crap. Why can’t we be good? Lack of tradition. Lack of money compared to the SEC teams we compete with, lack of a home state recruiting base (Ohio is giving us OSU and Mich St rejects). As long as we are in the SEC, do you really think we will surpass anyone but Vandy? really? I can give. You 10 reasons why we will never be good before you can give me one reason why we will.

    • Heywood Jablomie
      11:06 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Wald!! Props! Someone that can actually visualize reality!

    • Ivana B. Lumpkin
      1:23 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      USC was a doormat until Spurrier got there. MSST and Ole Miss have historically been doormats as well. There’s no reason to think we can’t become competitive in this league. James Franklin took Vandy to an 8-4 season in just a few years, and they have far fewer resources than we do.

  45. Ass kickings
    9:00 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    That is what to expect anymore. This team was beaten by Eastern Kentucky only to win on the scoreboard.

    Offensive play calling and scheme is idiotic. You have to either get a set of big boys on the offensive line and run the ball, or spread it out and chuck it to not allow their big boy defensive line to stop your run or kill you on a pass rush.

    Defense is this HC’s specialty. Teams are regularly scoring in high numbers on this unit. What gives?

    End of game, standard answer. Well if your not good enough or it’s not acceptable, let someone who is good enough make it acceptable.

    Patty Ice = Patty MELT

    KSR stop getting into the Louisville trend of nicknaming student-athletes.

    • Watch The Game
      9:23 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Actually it’s not KSR. Joker Phillips was the first one I heard use “Patty Ice”

  46. DH
    9:05 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Damien Harris is laughing his butt off right now. Seriously, though. He made a great decision.

  47. Coppertop
    9:08 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Our defense would be excellent at flag football

    • Heywood Jablomie
      11:07 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Those o-linemen would make great matadors. OLE!!!

  48. OldTimer
    9:16 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Last night was possibly the most embarrassing evening of UK football that I can recall. It is clear that Stoops and company are not SEC caliper coaches. Moreover, they don’t even have the support of their own players who have quit on them. We once again see where our dim-witted AD when left to his own devices has made a hire that is in way over his head. UK will continue to be the laughing stock of the SEC as long as Barnhart is at the helm.

    • True UK Football Fan
      9:24 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      I would think losing to FL 70-7 would be more embarrissing.

    • True UK Football Fan
      9:25 am November 1, 2015 Permalink


    • Ivana B. Lumpkin
      1:24 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      You must have not seen the 40-0 loss to Vanderbilt at home, where total attendance was about 200 people, including the players and coaching staff.

  49. #[email protected]
    9:30 am November 1, 2015 Permalink



    • 13th. Grade
      11:29 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Uh, it’s “Yahtzee.” If you’re going to troll, learn to spell. Maybe it’s time to actually enroll in that remedial English class you audited over the summer.

  50. Andrew
    9:32 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Just replay the passes even when we win, and you will see the problem. People were praising Towels, but if you look close, the passes then were not going to fly in the real SEC. Just one example, with some teams, passing behind a guy is ok because there is space. Against teams with great athletes that is a disaster. Our receivers do not look comfortable or confident about where the ball will go either. We need a high power offense at UK to win. What we need is a QB who can zip those short passes on target while throwing the deep ball. Those short passes off target just slightly are killing us even If they are caught. A split second decides if a block creates a lane. A split second takes you from a dead run to a stop. I feel that costing us first downs, and if you add offensive rhythm and first downs, one wonders how many points. It more than you think. I said the same thing after the Missouri game too…..

    • True UK Football Fan
      9:49 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Show me 1 QB in the nation that is on target with every pass they throw. If you can, then I will take this post seriously.

  51. Ucan'thandle the truth
    9:39 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Fran Curci’s third season: 9-3. Fourth season was 10-1. He played with strong running game (called a veer offense) thAt used 3 backs and mobile Qb. He was innovative, putting in all- American DE Art Still as a blocker in goal line situations. Any UK fan, myself included, who was a fan during that period knows we can achieve and compete at that level. That makes the struggles of the last 30 yrs so hard to take. Don’t say Curci’s cheated…he was charged with any recruiting violations or paying players, the man could flat recruit AND coach! The man beat Tennessee his last game as UK coach.

    I like Stoops and thought the program was moving in right direction but I’m afraid to say I think he is not HC material. The HC must inspire confidence in his players. It’s his main role: let the position coaches teach technique and schemes. That said, Stoops deserves at least one more year, especially given the fact he redshirted most if not all of this year’s class.

    • CATandMONKEY
      9:47 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      …and we had two years of probation after those seasons. Curci had a LOSING record at UK. He actually was the best coach since the Bear but he still compiled a losing record and put us on probation. Art Still isn’t walking through that door.

  52. shelby
    9:42 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    UK lost to Florida 14-9 on September 19. Kentucky would get shutout by the same Florida team by at least 7 touchdowns today. They’ve improved, UK has stagnated.

    • CATandMONKEY
      9:49 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      I think we would still score 9 but that would probably be it. Gators would score 40+

  53. Dennis Smith
    9:50 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Bow down to the curse of the Bear

  54. George
    9:58 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    At least Patty’s hair didn’t fall out of place.

  55. Volsfann
    10:03 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Your program headed in right direction, we just played our best game of season. Definetly see better athleticism on UK’s team. Advice: quit celebrating first downs!

    • Laugher
      10:38 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      LOL is there another school in dis ion 1 that celebrates first downs? And we chastise IU for putting up Sweet 16 banners

  56. Fred
    10:09 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Is it worth speculating if Butch Jones was offered the UK job when he was at Cincinnati?

    Earlier a fan posted that Bear Bryant could not beat Tennessee. I don’t believe that is correct.

    In the early ’50’s with Bob Hardy playing QB and Howard Schnellenberger catching passes UK beat Tennessee three consecutive years.

    • Heywood Jablomie
      11:09 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Not sure you could come with a cutesy little rhyme to fire Mitch and Butch.

  57. klassact32
    10:12 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Ladies and Gentlemen,

    All you have to look at is the first drive of the game. Ten had a 4th and 8th, let me repeat that, a 4th and 8 and went for it and got. There is absolutely zero respect for this “defensive coach” in the league. Nothing else needs to be said. Your telling me that a “defensive coach” cannot stop a 4th and 8? Pitiful, pitiful, pitiful. Where are all these playmakers we keep hearing about????? This team will be lucky to win one more game.

    • True UK Football Fan
      10:20 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Just to throw this out there. They didn’t go for it on 4th down because they don’t respect Stoops. It was because they didn’t trust their kicker who missed 3 field goals the prior week.

    • klassact32
      11:26 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Or it could be UK can’t stop anybody so why would I not go for it.

  58. lol
    10:23 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    You deserve every bit of disappointment you’ve experienced season if you seriously thought Patrick Towles was one of the best quarterbacks in the conference. Absolutely laughable, but not unexpected with this fan base.

    • Heywood Jablomie
      11:09 am November 1, 2015 Permalink


  59. Aja
    10:29 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    When he comes in pouting and fuming at these post game pressers, he just reminds me of a pudgy 5 year old who just had his Tonka truck stolen from his sandbox. He knows who took it and cant do anything about it.

  60. blue man
    10:36 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    My problem isn’t losing to TN. My problem is this team hasn’t shown any improvements. Stoops first year he lost to WKU, if they played this year, Stoops would still lose to WKU. I’m not sure why they aren’t improving, it took overtime to beat EKU, and that should not happen in his 3rd year. Tell me there is a difference between game 1 and game 8 of this season, there is none, if anything its worse. Call me a bandwagon fan or whatever you want but the fact remains, the job isn’t getting done with this staff.

  61. Dan Martin
    10:40 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    JFK once said, “Victory has 1000 fathers and defeat is an orphan.” Coach Stoops is the only person who is likely to take ownership of this game. How he handles it has a lot to do with his maturation as a head coach. This was not a great way to head into two road games to be sure.

  62. Laugher
    10:44 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    I’d like to see some honest commentary in the post game interview with Stoops. Rather than reiterating how we need to get better play, coaching, etc maybe the interviewer should ask Stoops whether he thought his team quit in the third quarter or why he wasn’t able to make the kind of adjustments a coach in his salary range is paid to make. Cut the bull. The mass exodus of the fans in the third quarter should speak much louder than all the comments on this board as to where this program is headed.

  63. Wise Guy
    10:46 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Has Towles checked out of a play all season b/c HE has recognized something on the defensive side? Remember how many times Couch used to check into/out of plays? I contend we have some good receivers that have made Towles and the offense look good all year and those receivers just got held by some good DBs last night. THAT is what made our entire offense struggle. Find a true top caliber QB or a QB coach that can coach him up and you will see much improvement in the offense.

    • Doug Pelfrey's Facemask
      11:01 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Couch’s offense was much more established. The current WRs run terrible routes, do not get separation regularly and drop too many balls. Towles also has happy feet because his O-Line is bad. The new kids on O-Line can’t get here soon enough.

    • Wise Guy
      8:36 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Will we know if the O-line is bad or if the QB isn’t getting them into the right plays to allow success?

  64. Heywood Jablomie
    10:48 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Same as your father’s teams. Same as your grandfather’s teams. Same as your great-grandfather’s teams. Same blind stupidity today. Thanks for the great comedy!!!

    • 13th. Grade
      11:41 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Who are your favorite teams? Let me guess, Clemson Tigers, New England Patriots and Kansas City Royals? Just because your team is struggling is no reason to quit supporting them. By the way, catchy screen name. I bet you’re a big hit with the middle school crowd.

  65. Tommycatsfan
    11:07 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    I don’t know who the Georgia QB is but he will be a Heisman candidate after next Saturday.

    I’ve been criticized on here for not drinking the blue Koolaid like so much of the fan base and I apologize because of the great progress our coaching staff and recruiters have demonstrated on the football field the last two games (I was at both games so I am not a troll of another team).

    I hope we fans understand we prob don’t have a lot of gas in tank after the last two gutty performances and UK won’t play as well at Georgia. Our coaches make such great calls and adjustments so I sure they are tired too. So just prepare yourself for what may be a big loss at Athens. We may get beat bad, like maybe by 90. But it’s just growing pains, right? Part of Stoops master plan. He is sneaky like that and I love him! You will see our progress to prominence later against Charlotte.
    So beat Those Dawgs you crazy Cats. Cough. Cough..,

  66. Tommycatsfan
    11:11 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Towles did throw a perfectly thrown spiral that hit a UT player in the chest which was really lucky because our players drop balls that hit them in the numbers. Heads up play by Pat! I love him!

  67. gottodoit
    11:38 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    We are a mediocre team, so let’s start from there.

    Despite the remaining games on the schedule, there is but one game left.


    Put all the other games aside and start viewing Louisville film today. Only a win against Louisville can remotely salvage our season.

    And just think how humiliated Louisville would be if they lost to us – why, it would just crash their season.

    • Tommycatsfan
      6:42 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Mediocre? Dude. We suck. Worst in SEC. Every f*ucking year. But we are bigger faster stronger. Right!!! Yeah Cats!!!! We are perennial bottom feeder in SEC! Hire me. I’ll do the job for 200k. We’ll 4-5 games a year and $3 million a year! Is any motherf*cker more over paid than Stoops. He is not a good coach unless deer in headlights is sign of s good thing!!!! Go cats. Away… Please

  68. Ukfanincincy
    11:39 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    How about another topic. Drove down to see my 1st uk game in about 5 years…had end zone seats , the fans only made noise if someone danced in their seats, no noise on 3rd down for defense, no yelling , nothing. It was 60 degrees and everyone was wearing winter coats , hats and gloves. Our fans acted as if we were at some middle school game on top of everything what’s the point of having the stupid chant for a 1st down ? I talked to a Tennessee fan sitting next to me and he asked if we thought we got points for a 1st down ?? I had to tell him that I was embarrassed as well. Pathetic. If you wanna be quiet go see a movie or go to the library. ….

    • Johnny Cutz
      12:06 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      You’re correct…we don’t have enough “true fans” to stand up and clap for 4 quarters like monkeys while we are getting throttled…yeah, it’s the fans fault there was no cheering.

    • leon singleton
      12:17 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      You don’t clap and yell at a funeral.

    • PatbeingPat
      1:13 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      You must not have watched many games on tv either. We give up first downs on 3rd down plays way more often than we stop them, once in a while we will make them go 4 downs before we give up the 1st down, just to mix things up a little.

  69. Stevesucks
    11:47 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Stoops should not be made do the post game pressers. He has no idea what just happened, other than we got the he// beat out of us.

  70. Clueless In Lexington
    11:51 am November 1, 2015 Permalink

    THIS is what a blackout uniform should look like:

    Whatever middle-aged straight white male is dressing our team,
    he needs to step back and let someone who knows WTF graphic
    arts is, be in charge of our uniforms. Right now, our uni combos

  71. Sullivan
    12:02 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

    For all the gloating over the ‘new’ commonwealth stadium, it appears to be a net loss. Capacity has shrunk and there are more opposing fans than ever before. But hey, ribbon boards with lots of ads!

  72. MustangCat
    12:05 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Where does one start? #1: we don’t have a “special teams coach” on board, and it shows! Painfully so. How do you do that in the SEC? The combination of top return men vs bad return defense = nightmares. #2: with all due respect, Schlarman has to show us something in the next four games, or he needs to go. OL is worse than last years, and we should be way better! That is 100% coaching, or lack thereof. Stoops should have seen bad coaching in year one. Offense all starts with the line, if that doesn’t dramatically improve, neither will the offense. #3: same thing is true here of the DC. So far, I haven’t seen much. I can see a little more improvement there then with the OL, but not much. Most of the problems on defense are coaching, and schematic. I can break down film at home and see that much. And I don’t spend hours doing that…..?! #4: if Stoops doesn’t get to one of the “qualifying” bowl games, that idiots say they would rather not play anyway, there goes recruiting! If recruiting goes out the window, Stoops is done after next year. If he doesn’t resign of embarrassment this year. I see 3 maybe 4 assistants that will probably need to go after this year, even if we do eek out 6 wins or more.
    For the record, all 4 remaining games are winnable games. Georgia may be tanking over the inevitable loss of their coach. Vandy is decent on defense, but not good. No offense at all. Charlotte should not challenge us, but will. We should still win. UL is good on defense, but scariest thing about them is mobile QB!!! Which is issue #5!! We are ridiculously bad vs a mobile QB. If we can learn to play defense before UL, we should beat them. Stoops needs to do some film work on successful teams, to learn what they are doing different. It’s not all about talent level and depth. Biggest problems this year, is coaching.

  73. Ukfanincincy
    12:09 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

    What blackout ? I didn’t see Any section in our vicinity with a total blackout. Maybe if the fans checked the weather forecast , they wouldn’t be scared to wear black t shirts , instead it looked like the fans thought a snow storm was coming , seriously folks …winter coats , gloves , hats ….last night hahaha ??

    • Johnny CuTz
      2:42 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Yeah, if only the fans wore black and didn’t wear gloves, the players would have showed up. Typical diehard fan dripping the kook aid. Let me guess, you are wearing another mans NFL jersey right now…I’m right, aren’t I?

    • Stickman
      11:59 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Our team sucks the big one with no signs of improvement since Stoops’ first year, and this idiot from Cincinnati is worried about fans wearing gloves and hats….

  74. Ukfanincincy
    12:14 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Hey Johnnycutz aka probably someone who wasn’t there, what about the 1st quarter when it was close ? It’s like pulling teeth to get anyone to stand up and make a sound . We have zero home field advantage.

    • Johnny CuTz
      2:48 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Dude, this is the first game you’ve been to in 5 yrs….you don’t get to comment on the fans attending the games, many of which buy season tix year after year with fairly low expectations to just win 6 or 7 and got bowling. I saw plenty of people going nuts watching the poop scoop.

  75. Jimbob Bautista
    12:16 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

    I wonder how many of the negative comments are from the same people, but with different names? If there really is this much negativity, I have to say that I’m shocked. When Joker was here, the team was unbelievably bad, and not competitive. I know this was a bad game, but can’t everyone see that the talent level has been raised? Do people really not understand that it takes more than 3 years to develop a football program (especially a program left bare from Joker)?

    • jim
      12:24 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Yeah keep telling yourself that. The talent level is barely better but this coaching staff has shown nothing for developing that talent. This team is no better than Jokers teams, and if you believe that then you are delusional. What have they shown to be better? Still took OT to beat EKU, blown out in the last two games instead of improving. Tell us where they have improved since game 1 this year?

    • Responder
      12:25 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      If the talent level has been raised its only in relation to the Joker era not the SEC where we still rank near the bottom in recruiting.

    • Shelby
      12:29 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Well, Mitch got rid of joker after “only three seasons” so maybe.

  76. Joker
    12:42 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

    I know how you feel Mark, I like the payday not the games.

  77. markp
    1:46 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Cat Paw I was not a fan of Pitino at UK. I liked us winning but he was a punk the way he would talk on the call in show with the fan base acting like an uppity Yankee. As far as Calipari, 2 NCAA issues that were player problems not his. If you compare him to Pitino or Petrino he’s a saint.

  78. Reality
    1:56 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Gotta love all the sky-is-falling chicken littles here. When we win two more games and a bowl bid they’ll be on here claiming they told everybody it would happen. We could well win 3 more and have a 7 win season with 3 SEC wins. If that isn’t improvement what is? Stoops has done a fantastic job rebuilding from the disaster that was Joker. How he got anybody to come here considering where we were is a miracle.
    Just another case of the UK football fair-weather fans.

    • Really!?!
      2:28 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

      Fantastic job rebuilding? Lol. Yeah they looked rebuilt last night when they tackled like a pee wee team. You do realize Stoops record at this point is no better than jokers right? Have you seen the play calling and just awful in game decisions? Not to mention not making any adjustments at all. Not sure where you see 2 more wins at this season, and next season the schedule is worse. No hope with this staff that can’t develop players.

    • True UK Football Fan
      8:58 pm November 3, 2015 Permalink

      Really- they might have the same record at this point, but the difference is Jokers wins came at the start of his tenure. Where as Stoops has been increasing in wins. That’s a big difference.

  79. Radmankd
    1:59 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

    Why so shocked by 52-21? Last year was 50-16. Much of the same personnel.
    Had a players meeting and put in extra work preparing for UT. Ouch!
    Offense can’t resemble much of anything with so many deficiencies. Starts with o-line, over-hyped, butter-fingered receivers and over-hyped, inaccurate QB.
    Have to agree with Matt Jones assessment on his post game show. Looking at the season thus far, we are just not a good team.
    We need to recruit the south harder: Florida, Georgia, Louisiana. The two and three stars from the south are going to give you more in the long run than our current strategy, provided the coaching staff develops them.
    Then there is…………nah, no sense beating a dead horse.
    Go Big Blue!

  80. Faye Roe
    3:29 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

    ……FAR Mork Stupes……

  81. Chase
    9:15 pm November 1, 2015 Permalink

    I am a FSU fan for life because my dad and mom met there. I applied and got into FSU but because I thought it was cheaper went to the other state school. I have followed FSU football for a long time.

    I followed Mark Stoops at FSU. I told my UK friends that Mark Stoops was not a good hire, but they didn’t listen to me. Stoops is a good recruiter, I will give you that. However, when Stoops was with FSU coaching the Defense I continually saw his defense get run over by Oklahoma and other teams. He is not that good of a coach but he can recruit. Kentucky has had a few good recruiting years, but it is time to prove that you can help your program win.

    • True UK Football Fan
      9:02 pm November 3, 2015 Permalink

      If i’m not mistaken, Stoops took FSU’s defense from 108th(I could be off by a couple of spots) to I think 4th in the nation during his time there.

  82. Dylan
    12:49 am November 2, 2015 Permalink

    What confuses me is if you go back and look at last years highlights. We destroyed teams that were easy wins. This year we could barely beat Eastern KY & ULL. I’m wondering how we’re going to look against Charlotte. Did we just play better teams or are we just getting bad?

  83. za
    10:41 am November 2, 2015 Permalink

    Y’all need to chill. We’re going to beat Charlotte and Vandy. Get off Stoops back. UK is not a good football job, so don’t expect some seasoned HC. Stoops was dealt a bad hand but has had continual improvement. Next season will be more of a litmus test for us.

    Rome wasn’t built in a day.